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#486302 - 07/31/15 07:44 PM Re: Matthew 9:23-24 [Re: Marinan]
victor-victim Offline

Registered: 09/27/03
Posts: 6300
Loc: š¯’Ŗ š¯’¦anada
Originally Posted By: Marinan
"Lord, I believe, please help me in my unbelief". That's what I have to think to myself so often when I'm constantly brain washed and conditioned to think of myself as nothing all the time."

in the fight between faith and fear.

"If I saw no signs of a divinity, I would fix myself in denial. If I saw everywhere the marks of a Creator, I would repose peacefully in faith. But seeing too much to deny Him, and too little to assure me, I am in a pitiful state, and I would wish a hundred times that if a god sustains nature it would reveal Him without ambiguity."
"This is what I see, and what troubles me. I look on all sides, and everywhere I see nothing but obscurity. Nature offers me nothing that is not a matter of doubt and disquiet."
"It is not certain that all is uncertain, to the glory of scepticism."
"There is nothing so conformable to reason as this disavowal of reason."
"For after all what is man in nature? A nothing in relation to infinity, all in relation to nothing, a central point between nothing and all and infinitely far from understanding either."
"We understand nothing of the works of God unless we take it as a principle that He wishes to blind some and to enlighten others."
"But at least learn your inability to believe, since reason brings you to this, and yet you cannot believe. Endeavour then to convince yourself, not by increase of proofs of God, but by the abatement of your passions. You would like to attain faith, and do not know the way; you would like to cure yourself of unbelief, and ask the remedy for it. Learn of those who have been bound like you, and who now stake all their possessions. These are people who know the way which you would follow, and who are cured of an ill of which you would be cured. Follow the way by which they began; by acting as if they believed, taking the holy water, having masses said, etc. Even this will naturally make you believe, and deaden your acuteness."

~ Blaise Pascal

Pascal's Wager uses the following logic (excerpts from Pensées, part III, §233):

God is, or God is not. Reason cannot decide between the two alternatives.
A Game is being played... where heads or tails will turn up.
You must wager (it is not optional).
You bet your life!
Let us weigh the gain and the loss in wagering that God is. Let us estimate these two chances. If you gain, you gain all; if you lose, you lose nothing.
Wager, then, without hesitation that He is. There is here an infinity of an infinitely happy life to gain, a chance of gain against a finite number of chances of loss, and what you stake is finite. And so our proposition is of infinite force, when there is the finite to stake in a game where there are equal risks of gain and of loss, and the infinite to gain.
But some cannot believe. They should then 'at least learn your inability to believe...' and 'Endeavour then to convince' themselves.


#487998 - 09/02/15 09:11 PM overcoming [Re: victor-victim]
victor-victim Offline

Registered: 09/27/03
Posts: 6300
Loc: š¯’Ŗ š¯’¦anada
The word “overcome”, “overcometh”, and “overcomer”, comes from the Greek word “NIKAO” and appears in the Bible 32 times.

nikįo (from nķke = 'victory') – conquer (overcome); 'to carry off the victory, come off victorious.' The verb implies a battle.

What is an overcomer? The Greek word “Nikao” means one that prevails, conquers, and gets the victory over. It is to surmount difficulties. Therefore, when we say we are overcomers we are saying we don’t think it strange concerning the fiery trials which is to try us, but we rejoice, inasmuch for we are partakers of Christ suffering and we know if we suffer with Him that we shall reign with Him. We strive to prevail over the difficulties which come our way.

“Whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world:
and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith.”

1 John 5

an overcomer is one that is first of all born of God, he must be able to surmount difficulties and prevail against them. the question becomes - what are the difficulties to overcome?

* The World
* The Flesh
* The Devil

To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the tree of life, which is in the midst of the paradise of God.
He that overcometh shall not be hurt of the second death.
To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the hidden manna, and will give him a white stone, and in the stone a new name written, which no man knoweth saving he that receiveth it.
And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations: And he shall rule them with a rod of iron; as the vessels of a potter shall they be broken to shivers: even as I received of my Father. And I will give him the morning star.
He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels.
im that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name.
As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent. Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.
To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.

~ Book of Revelation

“These things I have spoken unto you, that in me ye might have peace.
In the world ye shall have tribulation: but be of good cheer;
I have overcome the world.”

John 16


#489081 - 09/27/15 10:01 PM Re: calling all christian survivors [Re: victor-victim]
gettingstronger Offline

Registered: 09/24/13
Posts: 308
Loc: Virginia
Hi JustScott,

I know this is very late in coming but I just saw the thread and your post above (p. 3.)

Sorry you got hurt by that one who clearly had no idea what you're going through. I've tried to reach out as well at times, and it seems like unless it's someone who's been through the same thing, it's like beating my head on a wall. I get what you got. I'm also not following their logic that somehow your situation and difficulty finding the things we all need are an indicator of how you stand with God.

I'm an introvert (despite my job and business,) so it's really tough for me to reach out to people spontaneously. I also feel like a phony a lot of the time because of some self-esteem issues I'm still working on and a, uh, less than ideal upbringing. Trying to reach out to people who don't understand how hard that can be is like trying to describe a lightning storm to someone who's never seen one. You get a blank stare. Unless they're unusually empathetic, they just can't relate.

So don't let this get you down. It's ok to value your boundaries and alone time, and it's ok to reach out when you want to. It's not ok for others to start questioning where you are spiritually if you're honestly seeking God. Along with the others, I believe it's good not to be alone, but believe me, I understand how painful it can be when you try to connect and run into a brick wall. So I say do your best and don't pressure yourself.

Feel free to PM if you want!


PS: Victor-Victim: Thank you for posting all these verses! Much appreciated. B

#489895 - 10/10/15 07:38 PM Re: calling all christian survivors [Re: gettingstronger]
victor-victim Offline

Registered: 09/27/03
Posts: 6300
Loc: š¯’Ŗ š¯’¦anada
dear gettingstronger,

it seems i missed your reply from weeks back.
thanks for reaching out.

i get what you are saying.
it is good that we can find each other here share.

glad you appreciate my efforts.
nice to know you like the verses.
feel free to post some of your own choices.

my struggle for survival is something spiritual and special.

that works for me.

stay strong!


#491821 - 11/26/15 05:24 AM Life After Birth? [Re: victor-victim]
victor-victim Offline

Registered: 09/27/03
Posts: 6300
Loc: š¯’Ŗ š¯’¦anada
In a mother’s womb were two babies. One asked the other: “Do you believe in life after delivery?”
The other replied, “Why, of course. There has to be something after delivery. Maybe we are here to prepare ourselves for what we will be later.”
“Nonsense” said the first. “There is no life after delivery. What kind of life would that be?”
The second said, “I don’t know, but there will be more light than here. Maybe we will walk with our legs and eat from our mouths. Maybe we will have other senses that we can’t understand now.”
The first replied, “That is absurd. Walking is impossible. And eating with our mouths? Ridiculous! The umbilical cord supplies nutrition and everything we need. But the umbilical cord is so short. Life after delivery is to be logically excluded.”
The second insisted, “Well I think there is something and maybe it’s different than it is here. Maybe we won’t need this physical cord anymore.”
The first replied, “Nonsense. And moreover if there is life, then why has no one has ever come back from there? Delivery is the end of life, and in the after-delivery there is nothing but darkness and silence and oblivion. It takes us nowhere.”
“Well, I don’t know,” said the second, “but certainly we will meet Mother and she will take care of us.”
The first replied “Mother? You actually believe in Mother? That’s laughable. If Mother exists then where is She now?”
The second said, “She is all around us. We are surrounded by her. We are of Her. It is in Her that we live. Without Her this world would not and could not exist.”
Said the first: “Well I don’t see Her, so it is only logical that She doesn’t exist.”
To which the second replied, “Sometimes, when you’re in silence and you focus and you really listen, you can perceive Her presence, and you can hear Her loving voice, calling down from above.”

A parable/thought experiment from the Hungarian writer Śtmutató a Léleknek


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