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#77344 - 09/26/04 04:54 PM Re: More hatred
Ivo Offline

Registered: 05/08/04
Posts: 267
Loc: Germany
I can not believe that God hates me because of my sexual orientation, I just can't.
I believe and feel that I have full right on him. Why shouldn't I, I am his precious son.
You are also his son. It is simple as that.

PS. from my experience it is better to avoid discussion with fundamentalists, I do not consider them to have any faith at all.


#77345 - 09/26/04 10:39 PM Re: More hatred
Mike Church Offline
Moderator Emeritus
Registered: 01/23/03
Posts: 3439
Loc: Toronto, Canada
Marc these assholes are against anything that they dont know about. They are terrified of the unknown and so lash out. They would be the kind of people who if they found a live dinausor would kill it to see what made it live. And a lot of this fuckers have secret fears about themeselves methinks.

God loves us unconditionally



#77346 - 09/28/04 11:32 PM Re: More hatred
Dan88 Offline

Registered: 08/07/02
Posts: 247
Loc: DC
There are two ways to build any organization's stature. 1. By raising so many other people up that others see and respect your work so much that they want to join you out of love. Or 2., by putting so many people down that others loathe your work and want to join you for fear you will attack them next. It would appear that you had the one group from each camp coming together at the same event. Always an interesting contrast.

#77347 - 09/29/04 12:00 AM Re: More hatred
reality2k4 Offline

Registered: 07/06/04
Posts: 6845
Loc: Stuck between water, air, and ...

sure God loves all of his children whomsoever they be, he is not going to damn anyone for their sexuality, he made you.

There are many groups throughout the World some for good some for hate, God gives us all the right to choose love or hate. I know love is far more positive a choice, let these people just bubble over in their own hateful, pitiful World.

As long as good outweighs hate, then I think we have a chance of a half decent society,

take care


Whoever stole the Sun, put it back and we'll drop all the charges!

#77348 - 09/30/04 06:51 PM Re: More hatred
abcd Offline

Registered: 10/20/00
Posts: 189
Loc: GA

I saw your post and just wanted to quickly respond. I know how it feels to be ostracized, but remember that those who judge will be judged even by their judgmentality. I think I posted this a while back, but there are plenty of welcoming Christian organizations (including those from mainline churches as Lutheran, Methodist, Presbyterian, United Church of Christ, Episcopalian, etc.,) and even non-Christian (Reformed Judaism which is the largest Jewish group in the country is accepting of homosexuals). The truth is that depending on where you live, society is learning to understand homosexuality and homosexuals (just to different amounts--and in the most conservative bases, they are trying their best to turn the tide).

It is still hard, I know, but it may help you to remember that our fight is no different than those who fought against discrimination from interracial marriages (in the 70's they were accepted by only 4%, and we're doing far better than that now). Anyway, here's the site...

Also, if you want to read a fairly lengthy sermon on it, here's an interesting one from a highly respected theologian/academic in the Lutheran Church:

The Story in Acts that forms the text for this sermon is the conversion of Cornelius. He is the first Gentile or non-Jew who becomes a believer in Jesus, a disciple. A Roman soldier, a centurion (10:1) or what we would call an officer, the text claims that he feared God. But he had not become a Jew. This man has a vision in which an angel told him to send for Peter. Meanwhile, God is also communicating with Peter himself: vv. 9-16:
About noon the next day, as they were on their journey and approaching the
city, Peter went up on the roof to pray. He became hungry and wanted something
to eat; and while it was being prepared, he fell into a trance. He saw the heaven
opened and something like a large sheet coming down, being lowered to the
ground by four corners. In it were all kinds of four-footed creatures and reptiles and birds of the air. Then Peter hear a voice saying, “Get up, Peter; kill and eat.
But Peter said, “By no means, Lord; for I have never eaten anything that is profane
or unclean.” The voice said to him again, a second time, “What God has made clean, you must not call profane.” This happened three times, and the thing was suddenly taken up to heaven.

The vision offers unclean animals, things that were not kosher to eat. The vision is at times referred to under “creepies and crawlies.” Biblical texts have explicitly forbidden certain foods. Leviticus 11: among unclean animals are camels and pigs, anything moving on its belly (snakes), and in the water: anything that does not have fins and scales (shrimp, scallops). All winged insects are “detestable to you.” Touching such things defiles a person.

Peter is told to kill and eat three times. But not even a divine voice can get him to do it.
For Peter these animals are disgusting. Only the French would eat such stuff!
“I would not touch that with a ten-foot pole.” It’s enough to make a man gag. (For me: raw oysters). Note that this involves not just a biblical prohibition but a visceral reaction: disgusting!

As Christians we are not obligated by Ancient Israel’s food laws. Indeed, we have left behind other biblical texts that advocate: holy warfare, slavery, the second-rank status of women (no women could testify in court, study>


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