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#512556 - 06/25/17 12:02 PM When are they gonna pay
Ceremony Offline
Greeter

Registered: 09/15/16
Posts: 2123
Loc: Minnesota
When are they gonna pay
those wretched who betray
and justice is so blind
the victim can feel left behind
Re-victimized, those indifferent and obtuse
minimizing the effects of any abuse
and marginalized as we are,
so many like us, near and far
I shout it out, to get it out
betrayed, and this time it's out,
too much fear of being exposed,
when messages like this don't fit in prose
I want to be exposed, fight in their faces
make them sit in the hardest of places
and listen to me, before I smack them down
and make them know, Jesus' thorny crown,
was meant for the hopeless, the victim,
those sinned against, betrayed, dismissed!
Dismissed! Dismissed! d i too many tears,
the rage m i fears flow s s e d standing nears,
standing against those hated fears, submit
to my way, my say, justice must not omit
the victims know, and it's hard when he shows
how vulnerable his strength is, depth of word flows
In his head it's clear, in there, denied love
denied! DENIED and who believes brings their dove
an offering of hope, and the words,
Deniers, like ridges down to fjords,
are slopes of momentum, sand, pebble, rock and boulder
nothing holds back carried with many brother's shoulders



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#512614 - 06/26/17 07:22 PM . [Re: Ceremony]
oic Offline


Registered: 11/21/15
Posts: 210
.

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#512828 - 07/01/17 06:25 AM Re: When are they gonna pay [Re: Ceremony]
Tom E. Offline


Registered: 01/08/17
Posts: 445
Loc: FL
Both very powerful & moving to me..

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#512834 - 07/01/17 03:33 PM Re: When are they gonna pay [Re: Ceremony]
KMCINVA Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/31/11
Posts: 3825
very good question--do they ever truly pay for what they have done? I do not know if removal of ministerial rites, civil penalties or even criminal penalties makes them pay for they live in denial believing we deserved the abuse. Then there always seem to be those that believe the abuser was innocent and then re-traumatizing the victim or I hope is a survivor. Even with exposure they seem to escape the eyes of many who find their ways charming, beguiling or their own beliefs in the pious and holiness of those who serve the institution--be it a church, a university, a football team.

I do know one who pays a lifetime--the victim who struggles to survive and hopes one day to thrive.

Thank you for sharing Ceremony. I have felt this for so long and believe this sense of belief holds me back and pushes me to despair knowing I have paid a lifetime and many around me deny my abuse giving validity to the abuser. How sad and how sad they do not understand the harshness and cruelty of their words and actions.

You put the thoughts into words that carry emotion and thought.

Kevin

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#513698 - 07/24/17 11:45 AM Re: When are they gonna pay [Re: Ceremony]
Alonso Offline


Registered: 08/31/16
Posts: 18
Loc: Spain
I wonder how important it is whether they pay or not, whether they suffer for what they did or not. In my process of recovery I have used a book you might have heard about: Susan Jeffers' Feel the fear and do it anyway. In that book Jeffers advocates taking responsibility for your life. She gives 7 definitions of "taking responsibility". Number 1 reads "Taking responsibility means never blaming anyone else for anything you're being, doing, having or feeling". I have struggled so much with this idea. Not blaming my parents for brutally abusing me and destroying my soul when I was a helpless child? That's a hard one to swallow. Still, it looks like as long as we keep blaming our abusers we won't find the peace of mind we crave so badly.
_________________________
Life is not about waiting for the storm to pass. It's about dancing in the rain!

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#513699 - 07/24/17 12:02 PM Re: When are they gonna pay [Re: Ceremony]
KMCINVA Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 08/31/11
Posts: 3825
Alonso

I agree with her words but sadly when one is a child and their mind has been molded, rewired, altered in how it processes it is difficult to accept. I struggle with the memories and later in life the torment others inflicted of the abuse. I do not think I ever blamed the abuser but rather I have blamed myself for the CSA and what happened in the home. Everyone said that is garbage, the abuser is responsible for the abuse and the family is responsible for the spitting, abandonment, locking me in a room and etc. What I am responsible for is not letting their words and actions control me. Maybe on some subconscious level my allowing their actions and words to control me I am holding them responsible for my life. Not quite sure.

Sadly, I did not hold the abuser accountable for a lifetime, I tried to pretend--the old what if came--. I projected the blame and guilt onto myself. Even when years later others tormented me it further reinforced this guilt and the dissociation, PTSD and depression escalated. I had no idea who I was many days.

I am trying first not to blame myself and I am not sure if I ever really blamed the abuser. My T always said I would self abuse myself, believing it was my fault and I was responsible for the CSA and what happened in my home years later that sent me over the top and down a spiral toward death. The spiral moves downward, reverses and then changes direction again. I am in a slow downward spiral these days.

In the end I need to stop blaming myself. If I stop blaming myself, where will that lead me?

Kevin

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#513701 - 07/24/17 12:53 PM Re: When are they gonna pay [Re: Alonso]
Ceremony Offline
Greeter

Registered: 09/15/16
Posts: 2123
Loc: Minnesota
Hi Alonso, that's important to understand from the perspective of survivor research. Very important. Kevin states our brains are rewired, I've written about that a lot recently. I've been reading the research and understand how the brain fires and that genetically there are some changes which create higher levels of cortisol to in my body, than in someone who hasn't had childhood trauma.

The research I am focusing on is childhood trauma. That's the perspective that's vital for those of us who have endured it, are making efforts to survive it. I have a lot of difficulties, and for me, to learn the epidemiological source of my problems helps me. I can then seek to find what may be the best source of therapy to achieve a possible best case outcome.

It takes too much time for my liking, because, like it's said quite often, and not enjoyably, what if I had started this when I was in my twenties. Many of us are in grief for the lost potential, the wonder of "what if", though discouraged for our sake of affirmation and keeping an even keel, is valid, it is reality. It's obvious the "what if" is an opposite of affirmation for seeking the positive, but grieving is a process and a valid one when we're faced with a lifetime of waiting and pain. I waited 42 years to start considering being molested was a problem and I waited 39 years to bring my rape up. That's in my story.

It's with the wiring that being born and a failure of attachment and attuning to a caregiver created, that my fears and anxieties are automatic in my nervous system. I'm awash in cortisol, where someone without a childhood trauma blinks about it and carries on. The research shows a many times cortisol levels compared to none traumatized. I feel it, my tension/s are palpable, sometimes visceral. They drain me. My focus is to find some means to help my brain and nervous system manage that physiological problem and then put my physical reactions on the same level as others who seem unfazed by passing agitations.

I am profoundly agitated by certain external triggers while out in public. I may panic, I will certainly have high anxiety. I have been off medications for about 5-6 years, I actually don't recall, but it's been long enough to know my depression cycles in and out. I'm hoping this work I'm focusing on with therapy makes staying off that medication acceptable for me? It's too early to tell.

The interesting part of this, is that applying the practice affirmation teachings which seek to organically alter our mental perceptions of response to fear are part of the practice, the homework. We're wired differently and we have physiological responses that are in place because we're wired differently. To change those we need to practice alternatives, which you note by sharing Susan Jeffers. I've not read her, but will. I have been reading Janina Fisher, whom I find understands all the ramifications of what my brain is like and how to change it to what I want.

I'm unsure if Susan Jeffers comes from the same research as Janina Fisher?

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#514645 - 08/15/17 05:44 PM Re: When are they gonna pay [Re: Ceremony]
Alonso Offline


Registered: 08/31/16
Posts: 18
Loc: Spain
Sorry for the late reply. It takes me a lot of energy to write in the forums.

@KMCINVA: As much as Jeffers insists on not blaming others, she insists even more on not blaming yourself. Blaming ourselves might be an even bigger problem than blaming others. In my case I know it took me more than fifteen years just to realize that I was blaming myself, and I'm not sure of whether I still blame myself now. At least now I understand why I used to blame (or still blame) myself: My parents told me I was to blame, plain and simple. In your case somebody told you the same, but I don't know who this T is. Would you like to tell us?

@Ceremony: I hadn't heard of Janina Fisher until now. I just checked quickly her website to get an idea of what she does. It doesn't look like there is much relation between her work and the work of Susan Jeffers. Jeffers writes from a practical perspective, giving solid advice on how to overcome fears in general, mostly without getting into how those fears appeared. As far as I know she doesn't address childhood trauma or any other kind of trauma.

In my view her work can be useful for anybody who finds it difficult to confront their fears, including survivors of sexual abuse. In our case I see her advice very useful to gather the courage to deal with the process of healing and recovery. However, it will NOT help you to recover and heal by itself, it will just help you to find that courage. Having said that, I would recommend it to you or any other person who struggles with their life as long as you keep in mind what it can and what it cannot do for you.

Regarding the rest of your post, I think I understand what you say, but I can't see the connection with the issue of blame. Can you elaborate?


Edited by Alonso (08/15/17 05:46 PM)
_________________________
Life is not about waiting for the storm to pass. It's about dancing in the rain!

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#514646 - 08/15/17 06:21 PM Re: When are they gonna pay [Re: Alonso]
Ceremony Offline
Greeter

Registered: 09/15/16
Posts: 2123
Loc: Minnesota
Hi Alonso, blame is a "what if" for me. The way I expected that poem and what I go to with that other post weaves through my complexity. I like the idea that Jeffers has a forward energy, one to focus on preemptory action. I need the science of Fisher to maximize my hopes. The input of society, my past, current circumstances, etc... make the complexity of making progress somewhat herculean. It's not unlike sysyphus' rock. My hill is that complexity and all those variables the rock.

I've run across the idea that victimhood mentality is a thing, and to me, it's an affront, a method to re-victimize me. I bristle and will find my ways to negate the idea. I also know the I do some re-victimizing of myself. Self blame, things like "what if" and accepting in any way, victim mentality is a thing on me!

Blame goes to many things, and no one part of blame can help with healing. It's counter. However, there is, like how I think about doing proactive actions, a whole world out there that needs preemptory activists. How can changes we as male sexual trauma survivors help ourselves, find resources, tell our stories without access like MS, and the hope it expands to full blown societal awareness. It ties to politics, ties to social reforms, unity to be aware of rape culture and its perpetuation.

Ok, a lot there. I don't want to sidetrack my poem's intent with too much.

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#515582 - 09/24/17 05:16 PM Re: When are they gonna pay [Re: Ceremony]
Alonso Offline


Registered: 08/31/16
Posts: 18
Loc: Spain
You're right, I almost hijacked your thread, sorry about that. As you know I'm new here and still getting used to the forums. Would you like to continue the discussion in a more suitable thread?
_________________________
Life is not about waiting for the storm to pass. It's about dancing in the rain!

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