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#458903 - 01/18/14 11:11 PM On male (virginity) and meaning?
lfp Offline

Registered: 11/02/08
Posts: 122
It's been a while since I posted, but I do try to read the threads frequently.

This is about male virginity - question mark because there are some doubts about it.

I just turned 26 a couple of months ago. I've had some sexual experiences before that started when I was 20. However, while I enjoyed such experiences on a physical level, I felt there was something missing. A fundamental piece, some kind of 'connection' wasn't there.

I did it also to see how I deal with my boundaries and turns out that physically there's not a problem. But I have actively avoided going 'too far' (i.e actual penetration), even using protection because I didn't really know very well the women I was with. I don't know their intentions, their thoughts and I can't simply forget that there is a person on the other side. In other words, I can't see her as the 'something' that will give me pleasure and that I won't talk with the next day... makes me feel like and asshole. Also, one night stands, even if there is consent, would make me feel like I used somebody to 'get off'. Something doesn't feel well in the head because I know how meaningless this can be.

Yet at the same time I feel flawed because I am unable to detach from my feelings to enjoy casual sex, which most people my age seem to enjoy. At this point I have put sex (intercourse) on a throne, assuming it's the very best thing people can experience and that I'm not doing it, hence I'm missing out. I even feel like less of a person because of that. Isn't that a contradiction?. Also, I have been hanging out with a friend who has told me that 'she can do the favor', that we can be 'friends with benefits' but she does this with a number of guys and doesn't mind changing from one guy to the other; and then this becomes drama. And also, I don't feel connected, appreciated or that I trust her enough. This is holding me back.

Then I wonder, am I a virgin, when I have done other things while keeping myself away from penetration? This leads to the other question: who decides? I just want to find a way to avoid feeling so terrible, feeling like everyone has developed a healthy sex life and I haven't.
Consider the postage stamp: its usefulness consists in the ability to stick to one thing till it gets there. ~Josh Billings.
The Round Table, Mondays 7:30pm CST.

#458923 - 01/19/14 04:47 AM Re: On male (virginity) and meaning? [Re: lfp]
Jude Offline

Registered: 08/09/12
Posts: 1633
Loc: New England
Hi lfp,

Well this is one of my favorite subjects. In fact, I'm an what NOT to do. But here are some thoughts.

Most of us struggle with our sex lives, and/or lack there-of. In fact, many non-survivors do too. Sex seems like it should be so easy. And it always seems like everyone else is at it day and night. Don't consider yourself the oddball. You're just another guy trying to figure out something that has mystified men for eons.

So what is a healthy sex life? I think its just the ability to express your sexuality, alone or with others, without guilt or remorse, in a way that is honest and respectful of both yourself and your partner(s). The exact terms of it are different for everybody.

Lots of men have no problem with casual sex. The physical thrill of a new partner's body can be intense. And nowadays, it seems there are lots of women looking for the same thing. When I was your age there was alot of begging that had to go on to get a girl in bed. My how things have changed! There are also lots of men who prefer sex within a relationship. Having someone you can talk to after all the moaning and thrusting is over can be a wonderful experience too.

You sound like you have actually made up your mind that casual sex is not really what you want. Thats fine. What your buddies are up to doesn't matter. If thats the case, then maybe you should work on your relationship skills, and pursue a relationship when you feel ready. If you find someone you can feel connected to, the sex will follow.

Whether or not you are a virgin is probably beside the point. When you are being sexual with a woman, its sex, regardless of which part of her anatomy she is giving you pleasure with. Is intercourse the holy grail of sex? Some think so, but everybody is different. You'll have to decide this for yourself.

Who decides about penetration? Well, without getting too graphic, it's usually mutual. If you roll on top of her, thats like asking, "Is this okay?" If/when she's ready she will guide you in. Thats her way of saying "Yes!"

So to sum it up, how you express your sexuality is up to you. Don't judge yourself so harshly. You don't need to worry about some artifical standard of how its supposed to be done.
I will remember you
Will you remember me?
Don't let your life pass you by
Weep not for the memories
Sarah McLachlan

#458963 - 01/20/14 04:57 AM Re: On male (virginity) and meaning? [Re: lfp]
AndyS87 Offline

Registered: 12/12/08
Posts: 310
Loc: sorry, but I don't say on the ...
Hey LFP,

I'm also 26, not far away from being 27, also not what you could call sexually active. I find things confusing as well. I have a sister who is totally fine with undefined casual relationships and "doesn't want to rush into anything". If I was going to be involved sexually with somebody, I'd want to know if our relationship was going to be just sexual or if it was heading to a relationship. That way I could set my expectations about how much I want to let myself get emotionally involved.

Regarding the "everybody else is doing it" mentality, yeah, I would say our generation and the younger ones are going to be pretty highly sexual compared to the ones that came before us. We're not called "the hookup generation" for no reason, but this whole "hooking up" thing has really blurred the definitions of what relationships are. Are you friends with benefits? Friends with benefits with a possibility of relationship in the future? Are you a couple? Is the relationship open or closed? That's too much for me to think about.

I have a hard time reading women as well. I'm constantly afraid that if I make the first move, I'll make that girl uncomfortable. All the women I've ever been with have initiated with me, and if I was interested I'd pursue it and let things go wherever they'd go. That or a friend would say "Hey, I was talking to so-and-so and asked her what she thought of you. If you want to make a move, go for it".

As far as the actual being in bed thing, I can't say it any better than Jude. I tend to move slowly and if my hands start to go somewhere they aren't wanted, they get moved to someplace they are.

#459208 - 01/23/14 02:10 AM Re: On male (virginity) and meaning? [Re: lfp]
lfp Offline

Registered: 11/02/08
Posts: 122
Thank you guys, I appreciate it.

As you suggest, I might be experiencing some sort of crisis, or that I should not judge myself so harshly. Maybe I'm comparing myself a lot with other people and that's not fair either.

But then again, what would be the wise thing to do? All this is taking a toll on my self esteem because I see that most people have the *ability* to become interested in someone at some point, and they feel excited or nice about it. And I have never fully experienced that, so I feel flawed. And I am 26 so it really, really makes me wonder if there's something fundamentally wrong with me, or if there's something I need to correct and I don't know what.

Flat out, I just can't go on typical dates 'to get to know people better'. I can see myself doing that many times and I still dont feel that interested in anyone. Maybe a person will not be boring or something like that, but I still don't feel that 'need' to pursue them or to see them frequently... Likewise, I don't know if I want to engange in a romantic thing with them because I simply have no clue about such romantic desire. I grew up where I was considered a 'prince boy' and that everybody wanted me not for the person I am, but for how I look. When some people approach me I feel the same feeling of disgust inside, because all is fake, they're interested in the outside and not on the inside.

Also, I fear being emotionally numb for life and the older I get, the more I worry that the usual "you'll find someone soon enough" is yet another lie. I know I should not depend on somebody else, but I do wonder why is it that I can't feel what others feel... why are they excited on a date with someone and I am not even familiar with that? Is there a setting I haven't explored yet or I simply don't trust people?

I know some shy people (genuinely shy) that have the desire but they have difficulty with socialization. I don't even know what my case is sometimes... I for one know that I am not aspie or asexual.

Moreover, my self esteem is kind of low because I feel like I don't fit in this place. I feel weirded out, isolated and defective. I do NOT fit in here and feel like all the things I can offer are unwelcome. Most people don't have to deal with this intricacy... they kind of go more with the flow.

I am just rambling, I am hurt.
Consider the postage stamp: its usefulness consists in the ability to stick to one thing till it gets there. ~Josh Billings.
The Round Table, Mondays 7:30pm CST.

#459271 - 01/23/14 05:37 PM Re: On male (virginity) and meaning? [Re: lfp]
AndyS87 Offline

Registered: 12/12/08
Posts: 310
Loc: sorry, but I don't say on the ...
Minus the "prince boy" part, you word for word share the exact same predicament that I have. The ONLY thing that has ever worked for me is to get close to that individual as a person. I'm pretty damned shy around women when it comes to romance too. I do enjoy sex, but the anxiety of having to make any kind of approach overwhelms me. I don't think I'm all that attractive, but I hear all the time from friends "You'd definitely get a girl if you had more confidence, you're more fit and better looking than all of us, you have nothing to NOT be confident about". The thing is, I don't lie well and I don't censor myself well. I'm pretty much a "what you see is what you get" type person, and dating seems like a game that's fundamentally built on dishonesty.

Part of the problem is I assume rejection. Another part is that I second guess and overanalyze if I'm really attracted that strongly to those women or if I'm just trying to get laid. As one of my best friends said to me though, "See, that's a defense mechanism! You're using that to defeat yourself before you could every even put yourself out there to experience rejection". He was absolutely correct.

Sometimes we don't know when we fall for people, other times it couldn't be more obvious. This happened to me with a girl I worked with in college where I thought she was attractive, but didn't necessarily feel anything more than that. As our relationship grew though, I realized that something had changed. I've never ever gotten turned on from a girl just holding my hand and putting her head on my shoulder, and right in that moment it was just this "whoa, that was unexpected" moment, so I did what I usually do when I get emotionally close to people. I put a barrier around myself. Told myself "you work together, have the same friends, and live in the same dorm. You shouldn't date, what if things get ugly"?

Another time a girl brought one of her female friends to a party, and I don't think I've ever, before or since, been so attracted to somebody at first glance. Unfortunately, the girl who brought her to the party ended up cock blocking me when I made my move and that was the end of that. But still, that's ONE time in 26 years. Also keep in mind that as survivors of sexual abuse, things work differently for us. Sex is something that we might interpret as dangerous or shameful, so we might isolate or emotionally castrate ourselves in attempts to stay "safe".

If I can make one suggestion though, take 15-20 minutes and try listening to this. You might find it helpful to apply to your everyday life.


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