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#198331 - 01/07/08 04:46 AM Re: How can there be a God [Re: FormerTexan]
TJ jeff Offline

Registered: 08/07/04
Posts: 3594
Loc: Northern Wisconsin
My wife who is a christian and very committed to her faith, said that because I am questioning god and trying to understand what has happened, tells me that I am a non believer and don't have christian values. I desperately want to understand and be a fully committed christian and have a christian marriage.

The best advice I could give to your wife is to go back and re-read her bible - many times throughout the bible very significant people (even the apostles) questioned God - did that make them non-christians? - I think history has sure proved otherwise... God used them to do great things even though they doubted him at times

Who will cry for the little boy? - I will... - Antwone Fisher

Abuse happens in silence/isolation - Recovery happens only when that silence/isolation is broken...

TJ's History

#198345 - 01/07/08 06:28 AM Re: How can there be a God [Re: TJ jeff]
Coach Offline

Registered: 11/05/07
Posts: 29
Loc: California
In the book of Job, Job questioned God. I'm not exactly certain how old Job was when all his trials came upon him. However, God seemed to be able to handle it and had some pretty positive comments about the guy!

Christian values are derived from God's nature and character.

"Has God created us rational beings and shall we deny our humanity which he has given us?" J.R. Stott

Feel free to question it all!

"Knowledge is the foundation of Faith and makes Faith reasonable" J.R. Stott

You are committed to your Faith. It might just be abit more perplexing!


#198378 - 01/07/08 01:46 PM Re: How can there be a God [Re: Coach]
FormerTexan Offline

Registered: 09/12/04
Posts: 12162
Loc: Denver, CO

Let's invite those animals you mentioned to come join the debate.

Edited by FormerTexan (01/07/08 03:33 PM)
Money talks, but all it tells me is goodbye.

If I could meet myself as a boy...

#198416 - 01/07/08 07:01 PM Re: How can there be a God [Re: AndyJB2005]
Still Offline

Registered: 02/16/07
Posts: 7011
Loc: FEMA Region 1
Originally Posted By: AndyJB2005
I disagree with your wife. I think questioning God and exploring God is more faithful than just blindly believing whatever is said in the Church. Look at how much Jesus questioned the Jews of his time! I don't think God wants us to be robots, I think he wants us to think for ourselves and find our way to him.

I'm sorry you were abused by someone in the Church. \:\( Just goes to show that "men of God" are still men -- human -- not divine portals from Heaven. I'm glad you found us though. \:\)

I can't say why God lets abuse happen. I think he just created us and now lets us make our own mistakes. Once again, he doesn't want robots. It doesn't make it easier, but free will has to go both ways. \:\(


Kiwi, I understand your reaction to your abuse. Heck..I still can't handle being around jocks (older jock boys were my perps). I've learned to not blame ALL jocks..but I do greatly blame the arrogance and entitelment infused in jocks by the coaches, parents, etc. Does that equate into all sports programs being bad? I use to say YES! Was I right?

#198559 - 01/08/08 05:26 AM Re: How can there be a God [Re: BJK]
Danbuff Offline

Registered: 08/03/07
Posts: 249
Loc: NY state
Belief in each other is another form of faith. Faith in friends is also faith. I think even "non-believers" in moments of weakness might even run the possibility through their mind. I have always heard thank God, and never hear Thank science. I respect your opinions but, having a belief that things will improve or change is having some sort of faith. At least that's how I see it.


When you stumble, make it part of the dance.

#198560 - 01/08/08 05:30 AM Re: How can there be a God [Re: Danbuff]
AndyJB2005 Offline

Registered: 11/14/06
Posts: 1249
Loc: Minnesota
Everything you have in your house is due to science, so I wouldn't knock it. LOL Unless God invented the mircowave. \:\) LOL

Life's disappointments are harder to take when you don't know any swear words. -- Calvin (Calvin and Hobbes)

#198565 - 01/08/08 06:07 AM Re: How can there be a God [Re: AndyJB2005]
theatrekid Offline

Registered: 06/03/07
Posts: 702
Loc: oregon

#198566 - 01/08/08 06:14 AM Re: How can there be a God [Re: mogigo]
theatrekid Offline

Registered: 06/03/07
Posts: 702
Loc: oregon
Originally Posted By: mogigo
The golden rule is a Christian value

No it isnt. almost every single culture has a form of this rule many of which date back previous to Christianity.

Here is a list of the Golden rule being said by different religious/philosophical views. many of these come before christianity.

please give credit were credit is due. Christianity did in no way create todays moral code.

Judaism: What is hateful to you, do not to your fellow man. That is the entire law; all the rest is commentary.

Talmud, Shabbat 31a - thirteenth century B.C.

Confucianism: Surely it is the maxim of loving kindness: Do not do unto others what you would not have them do unto you.

Analects 15:23 - sixth century B.C.

Buddhism: Hurt not others in ways that you yourself would find hurtful.

Udana-Varga 5:18 - fifth century B.C.

Jainism: In happiness and suffering, in joy and grief, we should regard all creatures as we regard our own self, and should therefore refrain inflicting on others such injury as would appear undesirable to us if inflicted upon ourselves"

fifth century B.C.

Zoroastrianism: That nature alone is good which refrains from doing unto another whatsoever is not good for itself.

Dadistan-I-dinik 94:5 - fifth century B.C.

Taoism: Regard your neighbor's gain as your own gain and your neighbor's loss as your own loss.

T'ai Shang Kan Ying P'ien - fourth century B.C.

Plato: May I do to others as I would that they should do to me.

fourth century B.C.

Brahmanism (Hinduism): This is the sum of duty: Do naught unto others which would cause you pain if done to you.

Mahabharata 5:1517 - third century B.C.

Hillel: What is hateful to yourself, do not do to your fellow man."

first century B.C.

Christianity: So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets.

Matthew 7:12 - first century A.D.

Islam: No one of you is a believer until he desires for his brother that which he desires for himself.

Sunnah - seventh century A.D.

Sikhism: Treat others as you would be treated yourself.

sixteenth century A.D.

Native American: Respect for all life is the foundation.

Kaianrekowa, (Great Law of Peace), sixteenth century A.D.

Unitarianism: We affirm and promote respect for the interdependent of all existence of which we are a part.

eighteenth century A.D

Baha'i: Blessed is he who preferreth his brother before himself.

Baha'u'llah, Tablets of Baha'u'llah,71, nineteenth century A.D.

Native American: All things are our relatives; what we do to everything, we do to ourselves. All is really One.

Black Elk, Holy Man of the Oglala Sioux, nineteenth century A.D.

Humanist: Don't do things you wouldn't want to have done to you.

twentieth century A.D.

Wiccan: An it harm none, do what ye will.

Wiccan Rede - twentieth century A.D.

#198569 - 01/08/08 07:08 AM Re: How can there be a God [Re: theatrekid]
mogigo Offline

Registered: 04/25/07
Posts: 1331
Loc: Colorado
Wow Theatre, Thank you. Drives it home, awesome stuff \:\)

I can't think of a better rule


Edited by mogigo (01/08/08 07:09 AM)

#198598 - 01/08/08 02:32 PM Re: How can there be a God [Re: AndyJB2005]
MarkK Offline

Registered: 04/02/07
Posts: 2653
Loc: Denver, CO
Originally Posted By: AndyJB2005
Everything you have in your house is due to science, so I wouldn't knock it. LOL Unless God invented the mircowave. \:\) LOL

well .. actually .. my faith says without God you wouldn't have microwaves. you wouldn't have anything for that matter. man may have discovered how to produce them - but without God there would be no science in the first place.

my 2 cents.

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