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#353735 - 02/15/11 04:19 PM was gelman a victim of childhood sexual abuse?
westchesterguy Offline

Registered: 11/14/09
Posts: 421
Loc: Westchester County NY
does make me wonder...if maksim gelman was a victim of childhood sexual abuse.

what stands out to me -- before the killing spree -- was this guy's frequenting parks for sex.

but, as is often the case with these so called young monsters, we may never know. and even if he was victimized as a boy, this country does not accept childhood abuse as a legitimate insanity defense. he is just labeled evil, nuts, whatever and will indeed likely spend the rest of his life behind bars. and as usual...if he was abused... his abuser will never be to blame.


#353742 - 02/15/11 05:15 PM Re: was gelman a victim of childhood sexual abuse? [Re: westchesterguy]
catfish86 Offline

Registered: 10/27/09
Posts: 832
Loc: Ohio
We can never excuse the choice of a victim to cope by abusing or hurting others. He killed 4 and wounded many, none of whom was his abuser (assuming there was one). If there was abuse track em down and hang em high.

God grant me
The Serenity to accept the things I cannot change,
The Courage to change the things I can,
And the Wisdom to know the difference.

#353746 - 02/15/11 06:10 PM Re: was gelman a victim of childhood sexual abuse? [Re: catfish86]
westchesterguy Offline

Registered: 11/14/09
Posts: 421
Loc: Westchester County NY
Originally Posted By: catfish86
We can never excuse the choice of a victim to cope by abusing or hurting others....

of course. but somewhere in that darkness i for one would like to know what exactly happens to guys that push them this far - so far over the edge - that the result is just what happened in manhattan.

i think that fear of such a study is not an excuse. i think our culture fears knowing the truth because then it can be spun as a political excuse for such actions. so, we are stuck without answers to fix, prevent, future events like this one.


#354278 - 02/21/11 01:59 AM Re: was gelman a victim of childhood sexual abuse? [Re: westchesterguy]
LandOfShadow Offline

Registered: 12/11/07
Posts: 684
Loc: Minneapolis, Minnesota USA
As I've learned of the connections between shame and violence, and the huge number of men in prison with neglectful, abusive childhoods, we should at least document and try to understand how childhood abuse connects to later violence.

Not to excuse it. But to STOP it.

Et par le pouvoir d’un mot Je recommence ma vie, Je suis né pour te connaître, Pour te nommer

And by the power of a single word I can begin my life again, I was born to know you, to name you

Paul Eluard

#355035 - 02/28/11 12:57 AM Re: was gelman a victim of childhood sexual abuse? [Re: westchesterguy]
pufferfish Offline

Registered: 02/26/08
Posts: 6875
Loc: USA
Was Seung-Hui Cho, the shooter at Virginia Tech a victim of child sexual abuse (csa) ?

***Very triggering quote of Seung-Hui Cho's play.***

I have become convinced that he was. I can't understand why this was never picked up by the press or all of the other investigative bodies looking into it. I think it underscores the extreme ignorance of the effects of csa in our society.

Seung-Hui Cho wrote some material for his English class which to me clearly indicates to me that he was a victim of csa.

It may be that he was asking for help. He was declaring his
abuse and nobody picked it up, as far as I know, either before or after the shooting. It may be that he was telling the story of someone he knew.

Here is an excerpt from the play he wrote for his English class. In this play, the writer is 'John' and the abuser is 'Richard McBeef'. I have put some of the references to sexual abuse in red so that they are easy to find. I have made some minor corrections where it looked like the material had been scanned and the OCR had made incorrect insertions. There are too many sexual innuendos to highlight all of them. The play is entitled Richard McBeef:

Originally Posted By: Seung-Hui Cho

Richard McBeef by Seung Cho

Richard McBeef



(It is morning. The sun is s shining through the windows of
the kitchen. John enters the kitchen, grabs a cereal bar,
and opens it. Richard McBeef is sitting in the kitchen
with his legs crossed reading the newspaper.)

Hey John.

(He forces a smile at him.)

Whats up, Dick!

(He frowns.)

Try dad.

You aint my dad and you know it, you Dick.

(John chews on the cereal bar angrily.)

Come on, John. Sit down. we need to have man-to-man talk.

(Richard pulls a chair next to him from under the table.)

Man to man up your ass bud!

(John sneers then proceeds to the living room and turns on
the TV. Richard follows him, sits down, and faces him.)

I may not be your biological father, but Im your new father.
We live under the same roof. We really need to get along. Come
on, son, give me a chance.

(Richard gently rests his hand on John's lap.)
hand on Johns lap.)

What the hell are you doing!

(John slaps Ricahrds's hand.)

JOHN (Cont'd)
What are you, a Catholic priest! I will not be molested by an
aging balding overweight pedophilic stepdad named Dick!
Get your hands off me you sicko!
Damn you, you Cathloic
priest. Just stop it, Michael Jackson. Let me guess, you
have a pet named Dick in Neverland ranch and you want me to
go with you to pet him right?

(He sighs and ignores the comment.)

What is it you want from me, what do you want me to do? Why
are you so angry at me--

Why am I so angry at you! Because you murdered my father so
you can get into in my moms pant!

Now hold on right there mister. It was a boating accident.
I did everything I could to try to save your father.

Bullshit! Are you always full of shit, McBeef? I can see
that you are by the extra fat you have packed on! You
MURDERED my father and covered it up! You committed a
cons irac . Just like what the overninent has done to John
Lennon and Marilyn Monroe.


(Frowning, he catches a glimpse of an old tabloid titled
The Cover-up of Marilyn Monroe and John Lennon! !)

You once worked for the government. As a janitor, at least.
You hated the fact that my mom was with my dad. You knew
my mon was too good for my father. So you took him out and
stole her, you son of a bitch~


No, Dick You shut the hell up and listen to me.


Me what You want me to stick this remote control up your ass, buddy~ You aint even worth it man. This remote was five bucks. You are such a--


(Richard raises his hand to
strike his stepson, but before
he does Johns mom comes down the stairs.)

Oh my god! Whats going on?

(She covers and hu s John and
ushers him to the other end of
the couch.)

What are you doing to my son! You said you would have a nice
chat to get on terms with him. And this is what I catch you
doing What kind of stepfather are you? Pretending to be nice
to him with a take smile on your chubby face. Tell me, what
were you trying to do to him. You were about to hit him!
Damn you, Richard!

He was SUE

I dont want to hear it~

(Sue tells John to go up to
his room. But he observes the
spectacle half way up the

I swear Sue! I tried talking to him. He called me a son of a bitch

How dare you[ John would never NEVER--say such a thing, my poor little pocey pooey boy! He lost his father just a month ago.
Show some compassion! Some stepfather!

He tried to touch my privates.


(She gasps)

Holy shit! Oops. Sorry John. Dick, You son of a bitch

(She peeks at John. She
a r aches Richard and slaps
Richard in the head multiple
times. Taking off her shoes,
she hits him hard.)


(He brushes Sue with his large
arm and build.)

Sue Sue Sue. Listen to me!

SUE: (The manner and girth frightens her.) Oh my god! What are you trying to do! Are you gonna hit me too!
(She cowers and runs into the kitchen. She grabs the first thing she can which is a plate.)
Stay back! Stay back! Or I'll...
(She throws the plate, shattering squarely on his forehead. But he is unmoved.)
You fat piece of pork! John! Go to your room and lock it!
(She runs down the basement.)

Are you a bisexual psycho rapist murderer! Please stop following me. Don 't kill me!
(She throws wrenches and pipes lying on the ground at him, but he is unhurt.)

RICHARD: I didn't even do anything. Okay. I'll stop following you. (He stops with his hands in the air. He kneels. She throws a few more heavy objects at him.) Let me explain! John is a rambunctious pubescent boy!

SUE: Oh my god! You are a pedophile!

RICHARD: No ! No...Honey-poo .

SUE: Honey-poo?

RICHARD: Honey-poo. Don't you believe me? John is just a mischievous kid who having trouble getting over his father's death. He'll get over it. He just needs time.

SUE: Really?

RICHARD: Yes. Now, why don't we go to the bedroom and do it doggy style, just the way you like it, honey-poo.

JOHN: (In his room, he smiles and throws darts on the target that is the face of Richard.) I hate him. Must kill Dick. Must kill Dick. Dick must die. Kill Dick.., Richard McBeef. What kind of name is that? What an asshole name. I don 't like it. And look at his face. What an asshole face. I don't like his face at all. You don 't think I can kill you, Dick? You don 't think I can kill you? Gotcha. Got one eye... Got the other eye.
(He runs down to the basement by his mother's side.) That fat man murder dad. He told me so while you were asleep, mom . And he molested me.

SUE: What! Ahhh! '"'

(She grabs a chainsaw and brandishes it at Richard. He runs out of the house and into his car. Thirty minutes later John goes out to Richard and sits on the passenger's side eating a cereal bar.)

JOHN: I wonder why its so sunny out! Today is one fruity day!

(John stares squarely at Richard with a contemptuous look

who is sitting with a flushed face.)

Guess what, Dick. You wanna know something. You wanna know why I don't like you? Because you can' t provide for my mom. You barely make the minimum wage, man. All you do for mom is all this honey-poo shit . Honey-poo ! Honey-poo ! You piece of s hit ! You were a janitor one time. You 're a one time truck driver. You taught preschool kids for two months. And now you' re what you like to call yourself a chef, what the rest o f the world calls hamburger flipper. Back where you came from. The pinnacle of your career was when you were a pro football player. How long did that last? Three weeks! Ha! You're over the hills, buster! Just look at yourself, all fat and lazy. Only if you were smart enough to stay in the league, you wouldn't' t be like this. A former player. No wonder your name is Mc Pork-I mean McBeef. While the guys were packing on muscles, you were packing on McDonald's fat, chowing down on three Big Mac's in three minutes. You wanted me to call you dad? Okay . Hey dad, you are such a asshole! Asshole of assholes, DAD! And as for you banging my mom, looks like that lasted a long as your pathetic career, you prematurely ejaculating piece of dickshit. Sucks for you, you motherfucking McBeef .


JOHN: Eat this, you giant tree trunk piece of ass. (John sticks his half-eaten banana cereal bar in his stepfather's mouth and at tempts to shove it down his throat.)

RICHARD: AHHHHHHH! (He pushes John away and takes out the cereal bar.)

JOHN: Fuck you, DAD !

RICHARD: (Out of sheer desecrated hurt and anger, Richard lifts his large arms and swings a deadly blow at the thirteen year old boy.)

I believe that the de>

Edited by pufferfish (02/28/11 01:19 AM)


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