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#336898 - 07/26/10 03:53 PM What do I do now?
Pattycakes Offline

Registered: 05/23/10
Posts: 109
Loc: Canada
So, he swtiched therapists, he started group therapy. He bought me a gift to thank me for my support. I am the happiest I have ever been for someone! I am so proud of him and you guys too, judging from your posts in another thread.

What do I do now? I have not heard from him. Just an email saying he's bathing in the glow of his first group meeting. How is it possible to be this happy and this miserable at the same time? I have always wanted this for him. I have swallowed my pride, my pain, my feelings in order to give him the most support I could. I have helped him. I feel like a million bucks for doing so!

I also feel miserable because I'm still on the edge of this circle. Right outside the line. Outside his life. I'm not one to remember my dreams clearly but I remember this one from two nights ago:

In my dream, I remember feeling desperate to see him. I remember missing him badly. I think I hadn't had news from him in a while so I went and did something I would never do in real life: I walked to his place with the hope of seeing him. I saw him in his living room, watching tv. Another man was there in a chair, watching the movie too. I was happy to see him. I went back the next day and saw him again through his living room window. This time, there were a bunch of guys in the living room, sitting on the floor and talking, for what it seemed. I saw him, laughing! He was having so much fun with his buddies, in HIS living room. It was like all his privacy issues were gone and he could finally connect with others! I was drinking this image. I was so happy for him. And then, suddenly, he was next to me, on the sidewalk. I remember feeling embarrassed about peaking through his window. But the curtains were OPEN !! It seemed like a metaphor of his new life. Like he was open to people now. So I was there, looking at my feet, not wanting to look at him and he spoke to me. At the same time, all I could do was breathe is presence in.

Thing is, I cannot remember what he said in the dream. I don't remember it being positive or negative. I don't remember him telling me off but I don't recall him inviting me in either. This is why I'm miserable. I can't help but feel happy for him and at the same time I'm feeling sorry for myself. I don't remember feeling this low. Am I selfish? Am I being childish? I see the dream having different meanings. One of them is : turn around, Pattycakes, leave him be with his friends and his new life. Don't you see you're still on the outside? Can't you just get it? He's HAPPY now, and you're not invited.
Another meaning could be that nothing is set yet since the feeling was very neutral when he joined me on the sidewalk. Nothing positive, nothing negative either. So, maybe it means that he needs to enjoy his new life before he can realize that I'm still here for him, that I still want to be invited in. In the dream, he didn't seem upset that I was peaking through the window... But this was a dream, not real life.

In real life, he's not calling. In real life I still have never been to his place. In real life, I want him to take less time to realize what he wants. Less time than it took for him to realize he needed to switch Ts and to start group meetings. Is it selfish of me? No one needs to answer, I just know it is. If I was such a good person, I'd stick with being happy for him and wouldn't even pause at the thought of putting pressure on him. Having that conversation would be more than raining on his parade, it would be pissing on it.

According to him, I'm some sort of a savior. Nah, I'm just a girl who fell deeply in love. I'm a girl who, for the first time in her life, decided to follow her heart instead of her head. And so, since no good deed ever goes unpunished, my love helped him seek help only to be left outside his life. Or maybe, if we're lucky, the relationship will last and thrive.

I don't know what's going to happen. I'm sad and happy. Ok, I'm not pissing on his parade but I sure am crying over it.

Any of the married guys can give me advice? No need to be married, any experience with relationhips would help. Heck, I'm so down, I'll take advice from heteros, gay men, bi, transgender, wether they were in a relationship or not. I'm feeling so depressed I'll take advice from anyone who's even had an imaginary relationship... frown

I thank you all for taking the time to read this and for not judging me too severely. I thank all that will take the time to answer wether the answer cheers me up or not. I don't need a yes man, I just need different point of views.


If you judge people, you have no time to love them.-Mother Theresa

#336900 - 07/26/10 04:12 PM Re: What do I do now? [Re: Pattycakes]
Obi Offline

Registered: 12/28/09
Posts: 1634
Loc: kansas

i understand how much it must hurt you to see him in this state... but when he tells you this stuff of being a "savior" he's showing his appreciation to you....

how can we feel that low and high at the same time? well, when you've been abused it's an extreme situation.. a lot of us tend to deal in extremes...

this group therapy might have shown a light on a lot of things in his life and recovery. to be around others that have gone through, and experiencing, the same things is truly an eye opener. it helps us to not feel so alone.

another way to understand why we feel good/bad at the same time... is like the line we say to a lot of the new guys here.. of sad to see you need this site but glad you found us... we're glad because we have another brother we can help and who can help us but sad that there's another brother who went through the same crap we've gone through...

i know this may bother ya but recovery takes time... i can tell you that he honestly appreciates you and is showing it the only way he knows how to at this particular time... he really is trying...

i know it seems you have to sacrifice a LOT... it happens with survivors... but we, too, have sacrificed a lot as well... we want to get better. we want to lead a life of "normalcy" and even though we may have a hard time showing it, we really do appreciate all the help and support we receive...

for this i have to say thanks patty...


live another day. climb a little higher.

my story

my vlog

#336901 - 07/26/10 04:16 PM Re: What do I do now? [Re: Obi]
Pattycakes Offline

Registered: 05/23/10
Posts: 109
Loc: Canada
Thanks Obi/Todd,

I value your words. Although it is I who is happy and sad at the same time. Happy for him, sad for myself. I hate feeling this way. Thanks for telling me you also feel like that, although I hate the thought of anyone feeling like this, it is of some comfort to know I am not alone...
Thank you,

If you judge people, you have no time to love them.-Mother Theresa

#336908 - 07/26/10 05:45 PM Re: What do I do now? [Re: Pattycakes]
Castle Offline

Registered: 10/03/09
Posts: 758

It takes time.

There is a balance to this thing called recovery.

There are/were times my wife would see me online laughing at something going on in the chat room....The conversation went..."your so happy there, but Im HERE."

This happens, there is a bond that survivors have, an unspoken sometimes spoken moment of, we can just be real, chat, have fun, we know we have all been through crap. We often get serious, but plenty of mindless fun too.

So if im walking on the sunny side of the street and the glass is half full id say..

Give it time. Let the group work, give him some confidence and he'll be the better man that you need and want. Wont be easy but you've gone this far, give it some more time. He hasn't been in recovery very long and have the ability to change right off the bat. Let the confidence and the trust grow within the group, it will slowly expand to other aspects of him.

I'll add, it certainly is tough to lead the horse to water and he thanks the river. Once he quenches his thirst, he might look back at how he got to the river. Hes just so thirsty right now, its all about the water. LOL

I'll be around chat.

Best Regards,


#336910 - 07/26/10 05:57 PM Re: What do I do now? [Re: Pattycakes]
petercorbett Offline

Registered: 07/27/08
Posts: 2509
Hi, Pattycakes.

Selfish? No, Pattycakes, even i don't think so. I'll admit that when it comes to emotions with females,I don't have much experience. So maybe i shouldn't answer this.

I think that right now, he is overwhelmed by the acceptance of his other fraternal brothers. "He" has found others just like him who understand, who have been there. And at this particular time he has put you in the background (inadvertently), at least i hope so.

I wouldn't feel sad about yourself, Pattycakes, as you had gotten him to a very importaint point in his life. It is you who have gotten him there, because of your love, compassion & understanding.

I think in time he will start paying attention to you again. Be active in his recovery as much as possable, if he offers an opening, take advantage of it.

You, are a very special person indeed. I wish you both well in his recovery.

You have given him a very special gift. It is your compassion, understanding & love.

I hope that this might be of some sort of help for you.

My warmest regards for both of you.


Working Boys' Home 10-14 yrs old, grades 5-8. 1949-1953
A very humble alumni of the WOR Dahlonega, GA.
May 15-17 2009, Alta, Sep. 2009. Sequoia, 2010.
Hope Springs, 2010.

#336953 - 07/27/10 12:23 AM Re: What do I do now? [Re: Pattycakes]
SunnyGirl Offline

Registered: 07/14/10
Posts: 79
First, I just wanted to thank you for your kind words regarding my post earlier today. It is reassuring to know that other people out there understand what I'm going through and can empathize.

I can really identify with your post. I recently started talking to my guy about why he's pushing me away and I'm finally addressing the CSA with him -- an issue he told me about nearly 4 years ago but that he never wanted to discuss. He admits it is the reason he's pushing me away, but he is away from me and stuck right now, thinking that there is no alternative because he's not ready to get help yet. Despite telling me that, it doesn't seem like he's ready to close the door on us, either.

I talked to my T last week about how confusing this situation is -- that I feel like I'm getting mixed messages and I don't know how it's going to end or what to do next or what pace to take. Obviously, she's not a fortune teller, but she just told me that this situation is one that will likely take months to resolve -- the main question is one she had for me, though: am I willing to wait for this to play out over the next several months?

The toughest thing for me to often grasp is that this is his journey, his recovery, his life. As much as I want to be there to support him, I cannot change the pace in which things happen and I cannot force him to get help. He has to decide at what pace things move. It's hard as hell to accept that. Like I said in my post earlier today, I wish I could just take his pain on for him because I know that emotionally, I've got more love in my arsenal to deal with it -- I grew up with the love of both my parents and never had to go through the trauma that he endured as a child. But this is his battle to deal with so all I can do is convey my love to him and unfortunately, if I'm too strong about expressing that, I fear I will push him even further away.

Change is scary and it doesn't happen over night. I have to be willing to accept that and in the meantime, I need to walk lightly and treat him like a skiddish cat -- because I don't want him to perceive me as someone else in his life who loves him but is forcing him to do something he doesn't want to do.

With respect to your guy, I would give him some space, some time to think, for things to marinate and set in. I wouldn't read too much into his lack of calling you. It's a lot to process if he feels like he's starting to make a break-through. I think you just need to find comfort now in knowing that change is happening and be happy with that progress.

"When one door of happiness closes, another opens, but often we look so long at the closed door that we do not see the one that has been opened for us." - H. Keller

"Change & growth take place when a person has risked himself & dares to become involved w/ experimenting w/ his own life." - H. Otto

#336954 - 07/27/10 12:40 AM Re: What do I do now? [Re: petercorbett]
Geeders Offline

Registered: 09/03/08
Posts: 1901
Loc: Peterborough, Ontario, Canada
Hi PC:

The advice from the brothers above is all very good advice. I especially like the analogy of you leading him to the water, and he being really, really thirsty right now. I think Pete's suggestion of your b/f having found at long last a community of men like him must be proving amazing to him. Be proud of the work you have helped him accomplish PC. Be very Proud.

At the same time, please don't lose sight of whose recovery it is. Its your b/f's recovery. I think early on in your days here someone, perhaps it was me even, said to you that you have to allow your b/f to decide for himself what he needs. And although its tough to feel excluded, he's got a helluva lot on his plate right now. He's learning stuff that most learned many years ago, but with the added insight, or awareness that this is sorely lacking in him right now.

I'm sure he'll be like most, if not all of us. Very high highs at first, and crashing lows that seem bottomless. As time progresses, both of you will learn how to negotiate these highs and lows. It takes time, and perseverance.

It takes love to hang in with people like us. Thank you for giving that to him.

Be proud of what you have helped him acheive Pc. Be very proud.

This is a song I heard at my first weekend of recovery. Each day following, I played it countless times, just to remind myself of what I learned that wonderful weekend. Each day with the group and the new T, your b/f in encountering new thoughts, feelings, experiences and emotions. Maybe you could play this for him?

Hang in there PC. And be proud yourself.


My name is Jim
WoR Mysthaven 2008, Level 2 WoR Alta 2009, Kirkridge 2010, 2011, Oprah 200 men

#337139 - 07/28/10 11:43 PM Re: What do I do now? [Re: Pattycakes]
caesar14 Offline

Registered: 04/13/10
Posts: 70
Loc: Patterson, North Carolina
The way you are feeling right now seems to me to be a normal thing in such a situation. I can see how you would be happy for him and sad that you are outside his circle of trust.

My experience with recovery thus far has been like a roller coaster and through all the twists and turns and through all the ups and downs I have discovered that it takes a very special person to stick by there man through it all. The anger, fear, hate, and pain ate me alive for the first 3 months. I hope you can imagine what kind of emotions your BF is going through right now. The happiness I felt in being on a new path, one going in the right direction for a change has been constantly undermined by the currents of the above mentioned emotions. I am sure he is feeling them too. I would suggest taking a direct approach only when he seems on top. I know very well that I am unapproachable when I am bottomed out. Maybe he is too. I think you mentioned in a previous post that he has a very high wall around his heart and its hard to get over it. I know this wall very well, as I have built one too. Endure my friend and keep scaling that wall. I am sure the reward of finally getting inside those walls will be great.
Have faith in him as long as you can and remember he isn't broken, just flawed and flaws can be overcome.

You always have us here at MS to fall back on for support and I know each of us here are more than willing to catch you if you fall.

Caesar14 (Gary)

"The innocence you spoiled has found a way to live"
Things I have to say (triggers)

#337249 - 07/30/10 05:14 AM Re: What do I do now? [Re: caesar14]
Susava Offline

Registered: 07/17/10
Posts: 11
Loc: Mississippi, USA
Hey PC and others,

My situation on this subject is that we wait. We wait for them to face their abuse, we wait for them to face their recovery then we wait for them to face us.

Sometimes it is difficult to face someone you love and tell them something so horrible. Once it has been done, then sometimes the person is so embarrassed or guilty for sharing that that is all they can think about when they see you....
My hubby has been "recovering" for just over 6 months, Now, granted we are married and have 2 teenage boys, but there are time where we will not see him all day. He is either hiding or he is finding his friends on MS to tell them what is going on in his life. It feels very unfair that they get to hear when I don't. When I ask, he reminds me that his brothers understand and it may be triggering for me to hear. Then he keeps reminding me that the "average" recovery time is 18 months, and that I am a 1/3 of the way home.

I wait, when the bedroom door opens, I ask if he is hungry, would he like another bottle of water? Then I wait. There have been days where if we had a spare bed I would be on it, not because we are fighting but because he needs space.

Some suggestions though.... Send him a letter, a real snail mail letter, just a "get well" Hope you're doing well" card. Everyone loves getting mail when it is not a bill. I know these things are appreciated because my hubby just gave me a stack of them he wanted me to put in our "saveables" tote, the one we have pictures and first hair clippings in. Hubby had been saving them and looking at them when he needed me but could not see me.
Does b/f have a stuffed animal? if not has he mentioned one he used to have as a boy? If he does not have it find out what it used to look like and buy him one out of the blue. You can even send that in a wrapped box through the mail with a small note saying you support him. He will remember where it came from, he will let you in as soon as he can.

Sorry this was so long


"Believe in someone, trust yourself."

#337267 - 07/30/10 12:39 PM Re: What do I do now? [Re: Susava]
Pattycakes Offline

Registered: 05/23/10
Posts: 109
Loc: Canada
Thank you susava... I don't even have his adress. He doesn't want me to know where he lives, I have never been to his house.
I'm in a real bad place right now and I'll post a decent reply later. For now, it's just too hard.

thank you

If you judge people, you have no time to love them.-Mother Theresa

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