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#24619 - 08/02/05 09:25 PM getting off
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
I have been surfing around today looking for details on how child abuse cases actually work out in court. We have a few examples of guys here engaged in such cases, so I thought let's have a look. Here is something I found on a site that turns out to be lawyers defending such cases:

Quote:
If you've been accused of child abuse, you cannot afford second-best representation. Our skilled criminal defense attorneys practice aggressive, proactive and highly-creative defense strategies to protect your rights. The results are outstanding. In fact, most of our cases never go to trial, and many are dismissed!
Is this true? Does anyone know? What do they mean by "most of our cases never go to trial"? The charge is bargained down before they get to court? I am stunned at how ignorant I am about all this.

Whatever the answer is, it sure does show that guys like Rik and Andrei and Kevin are showing incredible courage in pursuing these cases.

Larry

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

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#24620 - 08/02/05 09:56 PM Re: getting off
reality2k4 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/06/04
Posts: 6845
Loc: Stuck between water, air, and ...
Larry, without resorting to the MJ case.
The barristers go through the evidence, and they can sure find ways of having charges dropped.

Its called plea bargaining where the defendent will answer to a lesser charge or not admit anything.

If he agrees guilty to the lesser charge then he will get some sentence, the more grave charge would then go to court.

It is sure difficult for any child to give accurate account because of the nature of this stuff as you will agree.

Barristers have ways of rubbishing the account of a child, which is sad, but money can get you the best barrister, and some of them can get you off with murder.

Yes, it does show incredible courage, and we will have to be for them, they are brave,

ste

_________________________
Whoever stole the Sun, put it back and we'll drop all the charges!

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#24621 - 08/03/05 03:52 AM Re: getting off
sophiesdad Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 04/30/05
Posts: 462
Loc: Florida
Larry:

You've been out of the US for too long . With enough money in this country anymore, you can just about buy anything - even getting away with murder. (oops am I alluding to the OJ case?)

It's a sad commentary, but many lawyers are royally screwing this country up (hope I don't offend any attorneys in this forum). I know that there are people who may be truly wrongly accused and they deserve every chance possible - our justice system is not perfect and there are people in prison who are truly innocent. But, I really get angry at those who get off scott-free when they are guilty as hell.

It's just a way of life, IMHO, in the US.

SD

_________________________
There are no unresolved issues - they just didn't resolve themselves the way we would have liked. "Grinder and Bandler - Neuro-Linguistic Programming"

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#24622 - 08/03/05 03:53 AM Re: getting off
RICK57 Offline
Member

Registered: 12/31/03
Posts: 1611
Loc: ENGLAND
Larry / Ste - I don't know about plea bargains in the UK which is where I am bringing the case. I did post recently that the case had been delayed, because there is now an additional complainant other than myself. The new complainants case is to be linked with mine, which is the cause of the delay.

I still don't know when/if the Crown Court case will occur. I do know that the CPS are currently very keen to take this further.

Where the Lawyers may have a problem in attempting to create a deal in my case, is that to all appearances, I have made a success of my life (despite my psychological problems).

I am financially stable and am making no financial claim against my abuser who lives on benefits (and has for many years). His everyday life is financed by the state...mine is financed through employment.

My whole aim in taking him to court is to :

1/ Achieve an admission of guilt.
2/ To prevent there being further victims of his perversions.

I don't see that they have anything to plea bargain with. Maybe he'll just die before it gets to court & give us all a rest.

My memory of the events is almost photographic and I am used to speaking to audiences. I also now have the power within myself to put bullies in their place (whatever position they hold in life - lawyer / judge etc).

I don't doubt that going to court will cause me personal difficulties, but I have absoultely no intention of accepting a plea bargain off anyone. It's pure and simple - he did it, he has to admit it, he has to serve the sentence.

I purely demand justice! It is my right!

Regardless of what happens, he has been identified in our Town News Letter & everyone knows what he is now (apparently many had suspected).

If Lawyers actively advertise their services in the way that you have stated, then I consider that they are most likely paedophiles themselves. Either that or they just like money that is covered in the blood of children.

Best wishes Rik...be strong (I am even more determined to win now).

_________________________
*Never look down on anybody unless you're helping them up.
*I was seeking a way of expressing my anger - I found hope!
*There are many battles before the war is won! It can be won!

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#24623 - 08/03/05 08:45 AM Re: getting off
sabooka Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/19/05
Posts: 209
Loc: I would like to know also
Rik,

You are a brave and strong man. Thank you for your courage and steadfast.

LONG LIVE THE KING.

Jonathan

_________________________
My happiness is not dependant on other people's misery.

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#24624 - 08/03/05 11:08 AM Re: getting off
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
Rik,

Quote:
If Lawyers actively advertise their services in the way that you have stated, then I consider that they are most likely paedophiles themselves. Either that or they just like money that is covered in the blood of children.
Yes, that quote is from a website of defense attorneys. It appears to be a kind of search engine. You fill in an online form with brief details and your zip code, and I suppose you get back the address of lawyer near you, or you get contected, something like that.

Their attitude shocked me as much as it did you. It is as much as to say that most victims who press charges are liars. I don't understand how anyone could even write up copy like this, much less put it on the net in a professional website.

I am so glad you are standing firm, and I hope I didn't sound like I was suggesting you should do anything less. I was just wondering how they can say that "most of our cases never go to trial". What is the reality behind that? Is that because deals are made beforehand? Or is it because the case is very difficult to prove? Or what?

Larry

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

Top
#24625 - 08/03/05 02:33 PM Re: getting off
Kirk Wayne Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/31/05
Posts: 499
Loc: Shrewsbury UK
There is also an explosion of "How to avoid conviction" websites on the net.

Plea bargaining does indeed go on in this country. My second abuser who was on trial held his hand up to a more recent charge, I suspect on the advice of his counsel.

The reason for this?

If he had not followed that advice he would have been brought into the frame with Jonathan Kings links to the Walton Hop disco (where this perp worked as a DJ) and that would not have done his defence any good whatsoever. He was find 300 and put on the sex offenders register for five years. for the second time I didnt get to give evidence and that was the fault of the Crown Prosecution Service.

Defence barristers in the UK are concerned with one thing and one thing only getting their clients off scot free and they will achieve this anyway they can and that includes verbally r*aping the accuser which was the case in the King trial by the acerbic defence barrister Ronald Thwaites QC. But I do wish I could have given evidence as I was called to give evidence at the Old Bailey but the CPS threw a spanner into the works yet again.

Kirk
"Instigate change, as it appears it wont come naturally in our cause. Sometimes it needs a little forcing".


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#24626 - 08/04/05 12:36 AM Re: getting off
RICK57 Offline
Member

Registered: 12/31/03
Posts: 1611
Loc: ENGLAND
Larry - it's OK I understand exactly what you were saying in your post & understand that you are fully supporting myself and others that are seeking justice.

Maybe some of our cases don't get to court, because we expect something even worse to happen to us if we don't do what we are told. Maybe some of us see Defence Lawyers as an Authoritarian Adult & therefore they must be right. Maybe we revert to child mode and give in to the adult.

Bollocks to that, they are 'educated sleazy bullies'. I expect that every dirty trick in the book will be pulled out, but I intend to stick to the facts. I also intend to be assertive (even if I am **itting myself).

I think that anyone that advertises in this way should be struck off for life for bringing their proffession into disrepute.

Come on Cheri Blair - how about it?

Best wishes ...Rik

_________________________
*Never look down on anybody unless you're helping them up.
*I was seeking a way of expressing my anger - I found hope!
*There are many battles before the war is won! It can be won!

Top
#24627 - 08/04/05 12:42 AM Re: getting off
reality2k4 Offline
Member
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 07/06/04
Posts: 6845
Loc: Stuck between water, air, and ...
99% of lawyers give the rest a bad name, hey, I got this in an email today.

How fitting is that!

ste

_________________________
Whoever stole the Sun, put it back and we'll drop all the charges!

Top
#24628 - 08/04/05 12:52 AM Re: getting off
roadrunner Offline
Administrator Emeritus
MaleSurvivor

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 22045
Loc: Carlisle, PA
Here is the link for the site I was quoting from:

http://www.pennsylvaniacriminaldefenselawyers.com/child-abuse.cfm

On that same page they refer the perp to all sorts of useful information: rights of victims, signs that a child has been abused, etc.

This same firm offers help with such other problems as murder, drug dealing, embezzlement, assault, carjacking, and so on.

Larry

_________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me
As I go walking my freedom highway.
Nobody living can make me turn back:
This land was made for you and me.
(Woody Guthrie)

Top
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