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#196719 - 12/26/07 11:06 PM living without him
Caetel Offline

Registered: 11/05/03
Posts: 322
Loc: Paris, France
Since the break up with V. (incest survivor, abused by his mother) I have tried to pick up the pieces, my own pieces. After the horrible break up and the insanity of diffamations he believed, I have been more aware about the necessity to protect myself. He eventually found out (for all I know) that he was lied to and manipulated but he never came back to apologize or to explain.
I have tried to date again. It didn't work because my heart was elsewhere and the guy I was seeing was not available.
Since then I have done a lot of healing work for myself and a lot of spiritual healing. V was always in the picture, we are soul connected and had karmic issues to solve. I did the work but so far he had not returned. I am proud of him, so proud. He graduated and he is now a psychologist with a private practice. I am sure he is doing an amazing work especially with survivors and with children. He is still in Paris. Last year I thought going to Québec and be away would help me cope with the pain in my heart. But I carried the pain with me. When I came back to paris I stayed with a friend only a few blocks away from his appartment. It was unbearable it was like I could feel his energy. As a result I closed down my heart which only caused health and energetic problems. It got to the point sometimes when I really want to die so that I won't have to wait for so many years before our souls can be reunited once again. When I realized that it was useless to close down my heart I opened it again and all the pain came back with a lot of crying. I have moved away from Paris to Brittany hoping that the distance will help me bear the situation and I am going back to Québec in March.
It has been 3 years and my love for him is just deeper, enriched with the wisdom gained in all my travelling and spiritual journey with native american healers.
Sometimes I am at peace and hopeful, sometimes desperate. Sometimes I wonder if I would meet someonelse and have a normal relationship, but deepdown I know this connection cannot be broken.
It has been three years and the pain isn't going away. My love isn't going away. Regularly I meet his looks alike. There was one at the conference in New York and last week one in the metro in Paris. This is very disturbing.
It would help me to hear stories of survivors who have found their way back to their partners after breaking up during their healing journey.
It would help me to know why he is not apologizing and explaining why he behaved so nasty when I had done nothing wrong.
Thank you for your presence here

Mitakuye oyasin ! We are all related !

#196831 - 12/27/07 08:28 PM Re: living without him [Re: Caetel]
evanescentjoy Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 12/28/05
Posts: 46
Salut, Caro~

I'm very sorry to hear about your situation. It is one that I can relate to on a very deep level, unfortunately. In my case, after three years of trying to reach behind the fortress he had constructed around himself, becoming battered and bruised in the process, I finally had to make the decision to take care of myself/preserve what was left of my wounded heart and spirit and move back to my home country - Over 7,000 miles away.

As you know from experience, the heart and soul don't let go so easily, however. Like you, there still exist ties that I can not seem to break and perhaps it is senseless to try. Perhaps the bonds were made for a reason and it is not necessary to completely sever them. But our love for someone can not and should not supersede our love and care for our own well-being.

A spiritual "seer" recently said the folllowing about my situation and I hope that it may bring some comfort to you, as well. It may seem that all your love, care, compassion and sensitivity (very obvious qualities of yours, judging by your posts) is going into a bottomless well, due to your V's inability to reciprocate because of his abuse; however, the appreciation and healing is very sincerely felt by him, on some deep level, even if he isn't able to express this. The abuse has short-circuited his ability to be able reciprocate, but it doesn't mean that your love and support are not felt and appreciated.

As was suggested to me - If it is not at an expense to your own well-being, why not continue to send kind energy and loving thoughts his way? They do help him, I'm sure... And from a safe distance, he may be more receptive. In any case, continue to follow your heart, but remember to take care of yourself. A drowning man cannot help another drowning man.

I have been away from my own V-equivalent for over two years, now. During this time, I have seen him evolve and change through the eyes of a close friend I left behind and also by the obvious change of tone in his (rare) communications with me. Very recently, over 2 years since we last saw each other, he even went as far as to apologize to me, which truly astounded me. He wasn't able to express what he was apologizing for in detail, but we both knew. I think I have evolved since our last meeting, too - I don't take things as personally anymore and therefore, his reaction/lack of reaction to my words or actions do not affect me as deeply as they would have, before.

It would help me to know why he is not apologizing and explaining why he behaved so nasty when I had done nothing wrong.

I have also spent much time agonizing and hurting, paying for sins I hadn't ever committed... Being forced to be his whipping boy because my heart was open and he felt something for me, in return.

Now, I realize that he was not able to explain why he behaved so nastily, or even understand how much he hurt me, until he came to some of his own realizations about his abuse [i]on his own time. [/i]

Interestingly enough, although a part of me will probably always love him, when I had moved on (as much as possible, anyway) he began to evolve in a way that I could clearly see, even from a distance. Also, from a distance, I found myself with an increased ablity to give only as much as I felt I could afford, without getting drawn into his "issues" on a continual basis. Now, his evolution seems astounding, to me, although we are still not in contact very much and I do not know where the journey will lead us or why God intended for our paths to intersect. Now, I believe that our meeting was as much for me as it was for him, although that is still evolving, as well.

Most importantly, I now know and understand that his situation is out of my hands.

I guess what I am trying to say is that when I stopped waiting for an apology, it came when I didn't expect it. An apology from your V may come sooner, later, several years from now, or never in this lifetime; however, know that his nastiness/hurtfulness was never about you and that the pain you experienced by loving him was everying about his feelings for you being twisted by his abuse. I believe that our CSA survivors hurt us because they loved us - because for them, love = pain and abuse. And from them, we have had just as much to learn.

Peace to you, Caro.

PS - Are you still in touch with V. in any way?

Edited by evanescentjoy (12/27/07 08:54 PM)
"Become who you are." -Nietzsche

#197070 - 12/29/07 10:55 AM Re: living without him [Re: evanescentjoy]
stride Offline

Registered: 03/07/03
Posts: 202
Loc: B.C. Canada
Salut, Caro.

I can relate to so much of your post here.

"It would help me to hear stories of survivors who have found their way back to their partners after breaking up during their healing journey."

Previously, during the many times that I had left my b/f, "B" (CSA'd by his father from age 6-12, and he's never sought help for the resultant effects/issues, though he's now approaching 47 yrs old), I held out hope that we would somehow, eventually, find our way back to each other and to a balanced, healthy, lasting love. B was, for me, "The One," and I am still aware of feeling that there is a unique, once-in-a-lifetime, profound, "karmic" connection between us. After over 6 years of effort and enduring on my part, I finally left him for good this past May, but there is still not a day that goes by when I do not think of him. He also lives mere steps from me.

All those years I kept hoping that he would seek help, or at least join me in working towards enjoying a bona fide, reciprocal, intimate, stable and truly loving (etc) relationship...that he would "show up" in the relationship for more than a few hours or days. All to no avail. As a friend once said to me: "You can't get peaches from a walnut tree."

Each time I left, it was for self-preservation, yes, but always there was the secret hope that "losing" me would motivate him to at least seek help for his issues, if not also with an aim to reunite with me eventually in a healthy and lasting way. I would leave for various lengths of time--even for 5 months a couple of times--and work on redirecting my focus to my own healing and rebuilding a full life without him. And each time he would ultimately win me back again somehow, whether through mere persistence, tears, pretty words and promises, or what-have-you.

In my case, it wasn't until I began reading about Narcisstic Personality Disorder that I came to the horrible realization of what I had, in fact, been dealing with all along. This may not apply in your case, but it was the "Aha!" moment I'd needed to be able to truly walk away for good. Soulmate or not, "The One" or not, something finally, fully clicked within me and that was it.

They say it's not possible for someone who doesn't love themselves (nevermind someone with NPD) to truly love anyone else, yet I still feel that B loved me (no doubt still does) more than he has loved, or loves now, anyone else. Does it matter? Does it even matter whether he has NPD or not? Does it matter that he may indeed have been/or remain still, "The One" for me somehow?

In our case, it's been 7 months since I last left, and despite a few efforts on his part to stay connected with me, I have moved on. Despite some significant, recent achievements in his professional life, he hasn't done anything whatsoever to deal with his shit. Instead, he took up with a 24 year old last summer whom he told me "mangles the English language" and leaves him "missing have an adult to talk to"--he even took her to Mexico recently--and he hasn't done a thing about his alcohol & cocaine issues, nevermind his CSA stuff. I doubt his porn addiction has waned any either. "Image over substance..." same old, same old.

Me? Well, I was just carrying on, working on myself and my own issues, with no real focus other than healing and personal growth. Like you, I had tried to date again a couple of times in the past, but my heart had always been with B, and I just wasn't interested in/emotionally available to anyone else. When I started hanging out last summer with a man I'd met a couple of years ago, I wasn't thinking of, looking for, nor interested in a new relationship. Still, the more I got to know this man, the more I liked him, and while he didn't seem remotely "my type" at all, I began to feel an attraction towards him. Within weeks we went from "friends" to lovers and I am with him still. He blows my mind every single day with how loving, thoughtful, self-aware/self-governing, dependable, trustworthy, kind, considerate, respectful, appreciative, romantic, passionate, sensual, generous, honest/self-disclosing, etc, he is. With him, I have pretty much all of the things that I had always wanted to enjoy and share with B. Interestingly, I don't know that I ever could have appreciated him nearly so much as I do had it not been for what I've been through with B.

Do I feel the same kind of attraction for him that I did with B? No. The same kind of profound, inexplicable, "karmic," core connection? No. Do I feel that I can't live without him? Obsess about him? *Crave* him in that same devastating way? No. Would my whole world fall apart if we were to break up tomorrow? No. No matter.

Still, soulmate or no, my new man is a million+ times the friend, partner, lover--and man--that B was. And the more I get to know my new beau, the more I appreciate, desire and enjoy him. He is so affirming! No drama, no crazy-making rollercoaster rides, and he has done a lot of personal growth work himself--a process of self-discovery he remains committed to--so we are able to have a lot of very cool conversations and to share so much more of ourselves with each other than I've ever known in any relationship before.

Perhaps I will always feel "connected" to B in some way...a way I have never felt with anyone else in my 46 years. Perhaps you too, will always feel the karmic connection that you do with your ex. Even so, I look back now on the many years I wasted wishing for things to be different with B & I...looking for the magic key...hoping for that sweet "Someday" when he'd 'see the light' and we'd live happily ever after. It absolutely blows my mind to realize how much of a gift "living without him" is.

Funny, B went to Spain in September and came back with gifts for me (though he was seeing his 24 y.o. g/f even then). I saw this as, in part, his way of "apologizing" but when I said as much, he got quite angry at the very suggestion and went into "attack mode." I don't know that he'll ever apologize for the horrible way/s that he treated me, whether he's aware of them or not. He's just not big enough...perhaps not even self-aware enough. I continue to work on letting that go...on letting go of any expectation or need for him to do so.

Caro, as EJ wrote: "An apology from your V may come sooner, later, several years from now, or never in this lifetime; however, know that his nastiness/hurtfulness was never about you and that the pain you experienced by loving him was everying (sic)about his feelings for you being twisted by his abuse.... And from them, we have had just as much to learn."

Everyone's story is different, but the feelings of love, longing, pain & confusion, sorrow, anger, hope, etc, resonate with us all. I believe that regardless of anything else, letting go--completely and without attachment to outcome--is essential for our own healing and growth. May you come to that gateway and step through it, Caro. Whatever the ultimate outcome, I promise you personal rewards that you cannot even imagine now.

Sorry for the novel! Hope it makes sense/seems relevant.



In the right formation,
the lifting power of many wings can
achieve twice the distance of any bird flying alone.

#197445 - 12/31/07 10:45 PM Re: living without him [Re: stride]
Caetel Offline

Registered: 11/05/03
Posts: 322
Loc: Paris, France
Thank you both for your messages.
EJ: I am not at all in contact with V. I have tried twice to make contact a year or two after all the crazyness and nastyness happened. I wrote two letters. I never got any reply. The last letter was in spring 2006. Last may I have felt very strongly that he wanted/was about to write. Very strange feeling. It lasted for a few days but I received nothing. That same month a healer worked on separating my energies from him. The results were a total disaster: desperate crying fits at night for 3 days. It was like someone was trying to rip my heart from me.
A few weeks later I got this message while in "astral connection": "I want to join you on the journey but before I need to know if you really love me". Strangely enough in August I did a sweatlodge and while in the lodge I started to scream "V I love you". It was like this incapacity to tell him I loved him (because of my own survivors issues)was suddenly released and in response to his question.
I have spent the last 3 years understanding and healing our karmic relationship. Even more amazing, my best friend and I realized that her baby girl is the reincarnation of a baby girl V and I lost while being Sioux in the XIXth century. V was his mom (and I the father) and they had both died of an epidemic. I have spent a mont with my friend and her baby when I returned to France. It was weird because the baby girl (now 11 months old) was spending a lot of time in my bedroom and every evening when coming back from her nanny she used to crawl to my bed and grab the photo of V and I. She was doing that every evening going straight to the photo. She looked at me intensely but checking my features: touching my skin and face like she was recognizing me and at the same time not understanding why I looked different. She also cried a lot in my bedroom the day I moved out.
My friend being very open she had sensed the connection way before me and says there is healing going on between M. her daughter V and me.
Sometimes I wish I could be able to meet someone I can be with in an easy relationship that does not require so much intensity.
I would be very happy if I had infos on V. progress in terms of healing. The infos I get are only through the internet when he writes an article (he is now a psychologist with a private practice). I tell myself that being the person he is, he must feel very guilty and must feel bad about what he has done to me. I tell myself that until he does apologize it will always be there somehow.
It is close to midnight here in France and my first thought will be for him. I am sending him love everyday. I guess the hardest is that nothing of this intense love makes sense.
Thank you again I let me wish you a wonderful New Year full of love and hope.

Mitakuye oyasin ! We are all related !


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