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#189271 - 10/30/07 09:04 PM whatever
Kathryn Offline

Registered: 02/08/07
Posts: 303

Just couldn't resist responding to the great thread on the gay survivor's side call "I'm feeling triggered".

It was stated by someone that ALL men have some desire/curiosity about having sex with a man. I don't know about men, but I sort of doubt it. Even the most open men I know and even the ones who are in touch with some level of homoerotic sexual curiosity don't really have the desire to do it in reality.

For myself, I've searched pretty deep for a "lesbian" aspect. Can't find it, try as I might. I do, however, have a lot of erotic attraction towards women. It just doesn't translate into sex.

Not to stir up a great debate, but I actually know men who value emotional connection nearly as much as me (and some even more so) when it comes to sex and don't have the propensity to sexualize every erotically titilating nuance in their lives.

This isn't to say that I haven't had my fair share of "meaningless sex", but give me the choice of doing it with someone who I actually care about and there's really no choice. Lots of people, both men and women, get to the point where another roll in the hey with another person who doesn't mean squat to you is about as exciting as riding a bike or taking a walk or doing any number of purely physical activities.

Anyway, this statement -- that all men have secret desires to do it with another man -- was in context of stating that labels do damage. A statement I agree with. However, to claim that ALL men secretly desire X or X or X is the very stuff of which the labels are made.

It's possible that a gay man flirting with a straight man gets a flirtatious response from a place of homoerotic (as opposed to homosexual) enjoyment. Women act pretty flirty with eachother all the time -- it's just that it's accepted.

Take care,

#189345 - 10/31/07 07:41 AM Re: whatever [Re: Kathryn]
dgoods Offline

Registered: 10/15/07
Posts: 622
Loc: Richmond area
you're obviously no dummy, but i could almost hear your eyes rolling at certain points; it reminds me of how i was once, w/ a ex g/f's lesbian friend, who i thought seemed to be promoting some sort of "every woman has a lesbian side, and that should be explored and accepted" agenda, which i thought at the time to be an externalization of her own difficulties w/ self-acceptance.
Whether that was the case or not, my drunken argument w/ this woman resulted in it being plainly obvious, whether i was right about her or not, that i didn't at all care for: the idea of my g/f dumping me for another woman, and the casual hook-up, "no strings" scene that this woman was a part of at the time. Being straight, i admit to being threatened by the idea that another woman has a far better understanding physically of what feels good for a woman sexually; hello inadequacy!
Couple that w/ the fact that my g/f was a survivor herself, and had moments where being touched by me was the last thing she wanted, and a feeling of resignation and bitterness crept in- therefore my attitude toward her lesbian friend was, "don't come tooting that horn around here, sunshine- she's got enough problems w/o you popping up selling lesbian hook-ups as a cure-all for whatever emotional problem a woman may be having."
was i wrong to think that? maybe, maybe not. but all anybody else saw was how threatened i felt.
I can relate to what you're saying, and am not trying to patronize you at all or be snarky, but the claws are still showing a little; i hope you don't resent the feedback. Just my 2 cents!

Give sorrow words: the grief that does not speak
Whispers the o'er-fraught heart and bids it break.

-William Shakespeare, Macbeth, Act IV, Sc. III

#189346 - 10/31/07 08:54 AM Re: whatever [Re: dgoods]
Kathryn Offline

Registered: 02/08/07
Posts: 303

Sure I feel threatened. But I also think it sucks, in part cuz I have a male child, that it's so easy for people to generalize about all men. I see the impact first hand on someone I love very much.



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