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#14931 - 10/22/02 07:07 PM Re: NOMSV
abcd Offline

Registered: 10/20/00
Posts: 189
Loc: GA
Dear Factsperson,

1) RE: "Could you please show me where I made CAUSTIC personal attacks on anyone?"

I'm sorry but I thought I said it plainly sir in my previous comment...I don't have time to go through every little thing, but for instance one thing I said is specifically, message #4 says,

"Why don't you be a man and come out and tell everyone that you are a perpetrator?" (in response to freevoice)

2) Re: "For example, another one would be I want NOMSV therapists who treat abusers "thrown" off the board!!"

You are misinterpreting what I said. I said up top in my 1st post to you (and may be you did not consider my opinion worth considering, but here is what I said...)

"Also, your suggestion of keeping people who treat perpetrators out is also missing the point of this being a volunteer organization--you take what help you can. Besides, I do not think it would make any sense for a person treating "regular abused" persons to now have to REFUSE to treat "perpetrators" if they want to continue helping "regular abused" persons (which is one of many ramifications that your suggestion has). In this case, I think it may actually help even as then the therapist knows how the abuser works and can help the "regular abused" person strategies to prevent relapsing into another abusive relationship."

This has nothing to do with being on the board but simply posting on this site, "treating" abusers, and the like...this is in response to your

"The issue is, once again, I feel that NOMSV therapists should not be treating perpetrators and victimes at the same time." (post #1)

3) RE: "Thank you for indicating I said that most people would LIKELY not want to disagree with the Board, that was almost an exact quote so at least you read what I wrote. Yes, after being abused by people in authority who you trusted and yet you had to tolerate it and you may have been dependant on these people for survival and nurturing, yes, people after a history like that are LIKELY not to disagree with the Board as it is very easy to associate (unfortunately) their abusers with "authority". I believe I stated that I found this unfortunate and sad however...I understand your situation with the Board, somewhat, but is it possible that you are disagreeing with me, saying I am wrong,etc. to sought of get on their "good side" with respect to your issues and you disagreeing with them? Think about it."

Maybe I'm misinterpreting what you said, but you're saying that "I" (since this is to whom your note is addressed to) am dependent on therapists?!! LOL I will not even touch that except to say that you once again presume to much and make this glaring generalization much like you are now saying that I am trying to get on the good side of the board LOL LOL No, I know you're not trying to bust my chops, but trust me on this, if this board were to disappear tomorrow...whatever. I have a life of my own and my posts to this site have been sporadic at best mostly in response to others rather than posts of my own asking for help and the like. I ask you again to not judge me...that in itself is very insulting and "caustic" in its own way. Instead of going to the meat of the argument, you attack the person saying that you're just saying that because of this (ironic in that you still want so bad some sort of poll from us whom you do not trust anyway to be any more than puppets, or dependents on therapists, or out to please the board--sorry, sir, but these are what you imply--you have nicely worded statements, but these insinuations are downright insulting).

4) Re: "I think that people who can affort a fee should definitley pay, this website and the organization definitely needs funds for support."

This is a completely different issue and I will not address this hear. They are already considering it themselves.

5) Re: "As for the anonymity of the board this is not so, just look at the website and it is posted who makes up the Board."

I meant anonymity of posters, but again, different issue entirely.

6)Re: "I do not think that it would be so difficult to tally votes from people indicating whether or not they want NOMSV boardmembers or therapists, etc. treating abusers using e-mail."

How would this be done or did you glare over my comment again. Using e-mail. I did use an anon e-mail for this, but if I had a regular e-mail that had said NOMSV on it, I would be terrified. Furthermore, until recently, I NEVER checked my anon e-mail. Thus, I doubt you would get a full quorum. More importantly, and I already said this...

"Anytime you make a suggestion, it does not mean that everything should be put to a vote with massive e-mails and polling. That would ground this organization to a halt when there is outreach to be done and conferences to be made."

7) Re: "However I think I have acheived one goal, to bring out in the open that NOMSV therapists treat abusers which I BELIEVE many people did not know."

Once again, as I said, (in my first post to you)

"Second, and more importantly, while I am not 100% certain of this board's mission and all that minutia, as an abused person, I frankly could care less that this board also has abusers or people who treat both abused and perpetrators. I doubt that every abused person here reads every thread. Based on my own experience, abused people will post something and simply get responses (and from what I have seen from responses to my own posts, they have always been helpful advice regardless of where they have been from). Besides, I almost expect that there may be some perpetrators on here and therapists that treat both abused and abusers. In fact, I am actually somewhat comforted that at least there would be somewhere for abusers to turn."

8) Re: "If people are actually totally volunteering that is fantastic. However one point is missing here. Yes, people are volunteering but they are also making a name for themselves in their fields."

This is particularly sensitive to me as one who does a lot of volunteer work, and this statement makes me especially frustrated at how you attack the character and motives of everyone. All I can say is that you can judge a person by their acts, I can not tell you anything about their motives. Let's leave it at that. Besides, my saying that it is a volunteer organization had to do more with how any normal organization works...imagine if the people who ran some clinic a doctor started was controlled simply by a vote of the patients? Not just that but one particular patient that seems to suggest that he can speak for the rest of the group? I am sorry, but while I am all for a democracy, this organization of sorts for most abused people here is well...only a website. It's not something that we have slaved over or campaigned for and the like. I have no idea about the in's and out's of this, and I doubt that any of the new members do nor do they even see this post of yours (they are here to post their feelings of hurt not to argue about some organization they have only come to know via the web).

9) Re: "I also have found resources provided by NOMSV therapists extremely thin and quite often people are selected for therapy to provide information to write books or articles not because who of is the neediest."

Again, this has nothing to do with MY comments. However, it does show me that you do seem to have a personal vendetta against NOMSV which sheds a new light on things. All I can say is that for me, and likely many others, this organization's help has been most crucial simply on posts and threads (NON-paying).

10) Re: "If you think that therapists who treat abusers are doing it only for the emotional rewards this is not exactly true they are also making a name for themselves in their fields."

Give me a field where doing your job well doesn't help...It's like your volunteering comment. The fact is that ages ago, professions as these were indeed altruistic and because so many people have become so thankful of these professions, they have decided to bestow some "honor" in these fields (that is why the doctoral profession is so respected). More and more, however, the awards have become more prominent--the volunteer awards or the esteem of the profession, and some have arguably entered these fields with less-than-stellar intentions. Nevertheless, I say long as they do their job well and help others, I have no problem with that. Many current doctors and surgeons, may be the most horrible persons in the world with less than stellar motives, but if they made a wonderful surgical procedure on my mom, then I would call them a good doctor still.

11) Re: "Actually one of the main purposes of my posting is to EMPOWER victims thru knowledge. No charge."

Thank have enlightened us, but you have also amazingly dismissed us at the same time with your labels as puppets, or dependendents on authority, or as out to please the board.

12) Once again, I leave you with this...

"Again, I appeal to your integrity here (and I do believe you are honest in your disgreement) and urge you to make an honest attempt to figure out what you are trying to accomplish here. I am one who hates to lose arguments too, but I think that if you think it thoroughly and practically, you will see that what you suggest ("a poll" or removing therapists who treat abusers from this forum) is simply unreasonable. "

#14932 - 10/22/02 11:07 PM Re: NOMSV
Roy Offline

Registered: 08/02/02
Posts: 184
Loc: Los Angeles

#14933 - 10/23/02 02:35 AM Re: NOMSV


This thread is closed and has been moved to the Ask the Board forum. The NOMSV classifieds: Events and Groups is for posting events and groups.

Factperson, if you wish to contact the board of directors of MaleSurvivor please email

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